Author Topic: Which products are giants, who still buys them.  (Read 2094 times)

Offline scrarfussi

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Re: Which products are giants, who still buys them.
« Reply #15 on: December 08, 2016, 07:24:45 AM »
isnt this what people said about
nuprime Giant killers
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Offline kamikazi

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Re: Which products are giants, who still buys them.
« Reply #16 on: December 08, 2016, 10:58:02 AM »
Well in a world where playback standards and consumers expectations have been lowered as far as it has, everything is giant killing. Just consider the decline in the sales of music, high quality subscription music services are loss making. It seems like it is just a very small percentage of hobbyists that still care about good audio. Lots of noise in a small community so everyone gets heard.

In the past the stereo system was an important component of the household. Today it is has to compete with many other things for a slice of the entertainment budget. Sad state of affairs as I think the entry level has never been more competitive and exciting, but in a country like ours and many other similar markets even entry level pricing is out of reach for most. Compared to how other hobbyist industries have managed to contain costs and drive innovation, the audio industry feels like it is lagging a bit.
« Last Edit: December 08, 2016, 11:30:49 AM by kamikazi »

Offline GoodEnoughGear

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Re: Which products are giants, who still buys them.
« Reply #17 on: December 08, 2016, 11:43:31 AM »
If we ditch the 'giant-killer' hyperbole, I think there are certainly good values out there that punch above their weight in their price bracket. Schiit and Emotiva come to mind immediately.

Offline kamikazi

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Re: Which products are giants, who still buys them.
« Reply #18 on: December 08, 2016, 12:20:53 PM »
If we ditch the 'giant-killer' hyperbole, I think there are certainly good values out there that punch above their weight in their price bracket. Schiit and Emotiva come to mind immediately.

They are good values in their home markets, but when you have to import them, lines become blurred as they can easily double in price. Support costs can also double so it carries more risk to the consumer as well. You also usually have to buy blind, unless you can listen to the product in somebody else's system. Manufacturers with better global supply chains and distribution networks can undercut the advantages that folks with direct sales models have in markets like ours. It often makes it tough to read too much in reviews, the value equation is often a big factor in the score or opinion of a product and it is very dependent on where the reviewer lives. I still like Schiit and Emotiva for their focus on providing the best possible products at affordable price points, but once you consider logistics and other dynamic factors the picture can look very different.

Offline GoodEnoughGear

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Re: Which products are giants, who still buys them.
« Reply #19 on: December 08, 2016, 12:45:02 PM »
They are good values in their home markets, but when you have to import them, lines become blurred as they can easily double in price. Support costs can also double so it carries more risk to the consumer as well.

Too true. And the selection of good value in the local market is meagre by comparison, just to make matters more frustrating. I confess I kind of discount the 'markup' as 3rd world tax instead of just living in the SA hole. I'm not content to think we should all just buy B&W and call it a day :sulky:.

Offline Eish

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Re: Which products are giants, who still buys them.
« Reply #20 on: December 08, 2016, 06:30:40 PM »
More often than not you get what you pay for.

B&W is pricey, but when you buy, quality is guaranteed.  If you decide to try your luck and buy Ching Qong instead at 3 times less.  You may be in for a nasty surprise.
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Offline Hi-Phibian

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Which products are giants, who still buys them.
« Reply #21 on: December 08, 2016, 07:26:33 PM »
They are good values in their home markets, but when you have to import them, lines become blurred as they can easily double in price. Support costs can also double so it carries more risk to the consumer as well. You also usually have to buy blind, unless you can listen to the product in somebody else's system. Manufacturers with better global supply chains and distribution networks can undercut the advantages that folks with direct sales models have in markets like ours. It often makes it tough to read too much in reviews, the value equation is often a big factor in the score or opinion of a product and it is very dependent on where the reviewer lives. I still like Schiit and Emotiva for their focus on providing the best possible products at affordable price points, but once you consider logistics and other dynamic factors the picture can look very different.

Spot on.

Added to that removing a tier in the distribution network is hardly innovative but it seems to be catching on.  Making a better mouse trap with a lower factory door price is. 


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Offline alternativeroute

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Re: Which products are giants, who still buys them.
« Reply #22 on: December 08, 2016, 08:28:50 PM »
The whole Giant killer thing is just marketing speak... In my previous incarnation as a seller of advertorial, people would send us text and pictures for their accommodation establishment. When you suddenly looking at 160 different texts of 50 to 150 words you notice 'trends'... In accommodation everyone wants to be a 'home away from home' and they are all 'super-friendly and super-clean' (and all their pools 'sparkle')...


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Offline Swindlehurstguy

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Re: Which products are giants, who still buys them.
« Reply #23 on: December 17, 2016, 02:08:32 PM »
Every other sales guy will tell you that his imported "X" will wipe out all the opposition, you call the opposition and they tell you that their product is better than sellers who sell "X". Most  of us will do our research and find out that in the USA Product "X" is very good, even though it may cost $20000 there, which is still a fraction of say the R550000 being charged here. IS it a giant killer? Yes at the recommended $20000, but is that still true if it is double the price here... NO! many factors come into play, aesthetics, build quality, ease of use, sound quality, upgradeability, after sales service. At the end of the day, best value for money will usually be found in used kit, or say something locally made. My take is that despite fluctuations in forex, some importers are becoming very wealthy with their mark ups...in my books that does not bring about loyalty.

Offline Jessejon

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Re: Which products are giants, who still buys them.
« Reply #24 on: December 17, 2016, 08:07:17 PM »
More often than not you get what you pay for.

B&W is pricey, but when you buy, quality is guaranteed.  If you decide to try your luck and buy Ching Qong instead at 3 times less.  You may be in for a nasty surprise.


Interesting.. I now own Ching Qong as described.. I also happen to have owned all the other famous brands including famous American, British, Swedish etc etc R100k plus pre , power , dacs etc.

I might just have ended up with the best sounding system I have ever owned.. at three times less.. I call that giant killing..

Quite a surprise..
« Last Edit: December 17, 2016, 08:09:23 PM by Jessejon »

Offline King_Julian_S

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Re: Which products are giants, who still buys them.
« Reply #25 on: December 17, 2016, 08:51:26 PM »
Interesting JJ...
same here( did not fall from such a high spot as you though 😂😂✌🏽️) and + I went 40 years back to get the sound like ...
I guess the best is to understand what sound you like...

Listened to a Denon 102 mono cart today ,,. Playing both mono and stereo ...
wow ... giant killer right there ...



Non audiophile music lover...

Offline naughty

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Re: Which products are giants, who still buys them.
« Reply #26 on: December 17, 2016, 09:13:01 PM »
isnt this what people said about
nuprime Giant killers

I think that items like the UDSD and IDA-8 certainly are and while there may be one or two items in their product range that are not as solid or well thought out most of their stuff performs better than reasonably well in terms of sound quality as well as reliability.


Offline Kent Kassler

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Re: Which products are giants, who still buys them.
« Reply #27 on: December 18, 2016, 08:13:36 AM »
Gulliver's cricket bats are giant killers.
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Online Dolby

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Re: Which products are giants, who still buys them.
« Reply #28 on: December 18, 2016, 12:02:49 PM »
Emotiva come to mind immediately.

The only thing with being in South Africa is that the value disappears when you bring it in with the shipping etc?

I've a huge fan and probably had around 11 units over the past 18 months, but I haven't brought them in. I started tearing up when I worked out the cost to import ;)


Offline legro

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Re: Which products are giants, who still buys them.
« Reply #29 on: January 15, 2017, 09:14:19 PM »
A bit late to the topic but must confess to just recently having acquired one of these giants. Would not surprise or disappoint me to learn that I could have had a killer for a fraction of the price. What would certainly surprise me is if said killer lasts as long as the giant.

While the upgrade monster always looms large, some do buy components in the hope that they would " last a lifetime ".

The vintage section of this forum is testimony to the fact that some components, if cared for properly, have the potential to do just that.