Author Topic: Which proper 4K UHD certified TV's are available in RSA?  (Read 4981 times)

Offline BoerieZA

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Re: Which proper 4K UHD certified TV's are available in RSA?
« Reply #15 on: October 07, 2016, 02:41:09 PM »
What??

Mate, "HD Ready" in the past means people bought monitors that could only do 720p. While full HD was 1080P.

4K is 4K. It's a resolution. It's freaking numbers mate. If your TV does that as a native resolution, then it's freaking 4K. There's no running away from numbers. There's no "HD Ready" analogy applicable here. UHD is a direct reference to a panel that handles a 4K native resolution. UHD Premium refers to the same panel but with HDR added.

It's really that simple. People who bought UHD panels this year simply didn't fall for the gimmick of HDR, which is a good thing as next year we'll see another gimmick. And so on, and so on....

The only reason monitors came out with "UHD Certification" was because some lame manufacturers were pushing panels which could NOT handle actual 4K resolutions (such as early LG's and probably hisense) but still punted the monitors as 4K.
« Last Edit: October 07, 2016, 02:43:47 PM by BoerieZA »

Offline ScottulusMaximus

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Re: Which proper 4K UHD certified TV's are available in RSA?
« Reply #16 on: October 07, 2016, 02:46:39 PM »
Again, 4k is not UHD.

UHD is a new television standard of which the consumer facing side is labelled as "UltraHD Premium".

HD Ready and FHD were(and still are) sold as HD TV's. HD Ready is NOT HD.

4k and UltraHD Premium will be sold as UHD TV's. 4k TV's are NOT UHD.

Justify your purchase to yourself however you want but stop spreading misinformation.

"UltraHD Premium" is not a gimmick, it is a new broadcast standard.
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Offline BoerieZA

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Re: Which proper 4K UHD certified TV's are available in RSA?
« Reply #17 on: October 07, 2016, 02:48:55 PM »
Might wanna tell these guys to stop the "misinformation" too:

http://www.techradar.com/news/television/ultra-hd-everything-you-need-to-know-about-4k-tv-1048954

 :blah: :blah: :blah: :blah:

You seem to be laboring under the impression that saying UHD is the same as saying Premium UHD. The only problem is that you're omitting an entire word. Like someone just saying "Moron". But trying to imply that "You're a moron".

No matter how you try and convince yourself to "hold out" champ, UHD refers to a resolution that a television is capable of supporting. That's the end of it. Stating that's it's UHD Premium certified is what YOU are referring to and it's a whole other ball-game because those features WILL change annually making EVERY television outdated on the same annual basis.

But I digress. I'll stop spreading misinformation  :pleasant: while you tell people that televisions that run 4K resolutions natively are indeed not "UHD" but some bastard form of 1080P. Good luck.  :thumbs:
« Last Edit: October 07, 2016, 02:59:18 PM by BoerieZA »

Offline ScottulusMaximus

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Re: Which proper 4K UHD certified TV's are available in RSA?
« Reply #18 on: October 07, 2016, 03:02:17 PM »
For someone who claims to know a lot of stuff about this it's odd that you bought a TV with no HDR, no 10bit colour and no HDMI 2.0a... Those gimmicks too? Try feed a UHD signal into that and it'll wet it's pants...

But hey, it's 4k so it MUST be UHD, apart from the fact it only fulfills one of the UHD requirements  :whistler:

It's confusing, hence the original question by Juggy: "Which proper 4K UHD certified TV's are available in RSA?"
« Last Edit: October 07, 2016, 03:04:58 PM by ScottulusMaximus »
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Offline KenMasters

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Re: Which proper 4K UHD certified TV's are available in RSA?
« Reply #19 on: October 07, 2016, 03:11:53 PM »
Here's a practical example: My television is a 75JU6400 Samsung LED LCD Television. Does it support true 4k resolution? Yes. Does it support HDR? No. So does it have the UltraHD Premium logo? No. But it's still a true UHD television? Yes.

It's not an "Ultra HD" TV no, which is the standards name, not UHD but Ultra HD (in full).

Essentially what you have bought is an HDTV with a 4K pixel count. Ultra HD is about far more than resolution, "HDR" is just the marketing term they're using to package these changes for consumer awareness purposes. It is the new standard for TV at home.

Make no mistake though, they will be getting better and better year on year, "Ultra HD Premium" certification just means the panel meets the standard's minimum requirements. Current technology doesn't allow for the full standard to be met, but you will have the meat and potatoes of what Ultra HD offers - it just means a few years down the line when you do upgrade you'll get that much more out of the format, but it will be the same format.

This is not the same as all the other marketing terms manufacturers come out with every year, this is a big shift, the last format change was from SD to HD and all that really changed there was the resolution, this overhauls the whole video system (SD and HD were based on the performance characteristics of CRTs, Ultra HD takes its cues from our own visual system).
« Last Edit: October 07, 2016, 03:34:32 PM by KenMasters »

Offline KLK

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Re: Which proper 4K UHD certified TV's are available in RSA?
« Reply #20 on: October 07, 2016, 04:02:30 PM »
Make no mistake though, they will be getting better and better year on year, "Ultra HD Premium" certification just means the panel meets the standard's minimum requirements. Current technology doesn't allow for the full standard to be met, but you will have the meat and potatoes of what Ultra HD offers - it just means a few years down the line when you do upgrade you'll get that much more out of the format, but it will be the same format.

Hey Ken, so you saying there is a number of factors for the TV's to be Ultra HD Premium certified?
So I assume then that some of those were the 1000nits brightness, 10 bit panel (for now), what are the others if you do know? Also going back to the refresh rate, don't most of the higher end tv's have higher refresh rates greater than 120hz?

Then is this why LG doesn't have much UHD certified TV's on the market? (well SA) so from SA market only the samsung ks series is certified, any others? Then of the older models of the samsung was it only the js9500 which would in essence be "certified" as has the requirements?

Sorry for so many questions.

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Offline KLK

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Re: Which proper 4K UHD certified TV's are available in RSA?
« Reply #21 on: October 07, 2016, 04:14:53 PM »
For someone who claims to know a lot of stuff about this it's odd that you bought a TV with no HDR, no 10bit colour and no HDMI 2.0a...

sorry know off the topic, do you need hdmi 2a to transfer the HDR data? If so have you seen how hard those are to come by? I havent seen a supplier (well on ebay and some sa sites) which supplies hdmi 2a cables.

If you do know where to source would be awesome if can tell me where.

Thanks

Offline Dolby

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Re: Which proper 4K UHD certified TV's are available in RSA?
« Reply #22 on: October 07, 2016, 04:49:43 PM »
And another offtopic ....

Netflix SA does 4k/UHD streaming?

I've realised I can do a 4k/UHD stream on my 19kbps internet connection - albeit stereo sound.

Offline ScottulusMaximus

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Re: Which proper 4K UHD certified TV's are available in RSA?
« Reply #23 on: October 07, 2016, 04:59:32 PM »
sorry know off the topic, do you need hdmi 2a to transfer the HDR data? If so have you seen how hard those are to come by? I havent seen a supplier (well on ebay and some sa sites) which supplies hdmi 2a cables.

If you do know where to source would be awesome if can tell me where.

Thanks

ANY high-speed HDMI cable will work with 2.0a, you do NOT need fancy cables for it.
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Offline KenMasters

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Re: Which proper 4K UHD certified TV's are available in RSA?
« Reply #24 on: October 07, 2016, 05:14:36 PM »
Hey Ken, so you saying there is a number of factors for the TV's to be Ultra HD Premium certified?
So I assume then that some of those were the 1000nits brightness, 10 bit panel (for now), what are the others if you do know?

For Ultra HD Premium certification the TV at minimum needs the following:

Image Resolution: 38402160

Colour Bit Depth: 10-bit signal

Colour Gamut:
Signal Input: BT.2020 color representation
Display Reproduction: More than 90% of DCI-P3 colours

High Dynamic Range:
SMPTE ST2084 EOTF

Contrast performance:
More than 1000 nits peak brightness and less than 0.05 nits black level; or
More than 540 nits peak brightness and less than 0.0005 nits black level


Also going back to the refresh rate, don't most of the higher end tv's have higher refresh rates greater than 120hz?

The max refresh rate TVs accept is 60Hz, as the HDTV standard refresh rates are 24Hz/30Hz/50Hz/60Hz (to round off). Panels that advertise higher refresh rates than that are not talking about what they can accept but rather what they output.

The reason why they have these higher refresh rates is because of their motion resolution improving systems, "Motionflow", "Auto Motion", "Smooth Motion" etc. They take the existing signal and merge each consecutive frame then insert that interpolated frame between the original frames. The extra "Hz" are where those frames slot in. If you don't make use of those features then you don't benefit from the 120Hz aspect of the panel.

Then is this why LG doesn't have much UHD certified TV's on the market? (well SA) so from SA market only the samsung ks series is certified, any others?

LG uses IPS panels which are not known for their contrast, my guess is they fall short of the minimum spec in that regard. LG's OLEDs make certification though (but I do feel the low peak brightness requirement for OLED is something of a concession to the technology).

Then of the older models of the samsung was it only the js9500 which would in essence be "certified" as has the requirements?

Yes, the JS9500 on paper makes the cut, but I couldn't tell you if everything was properly implemented.
« Last Edit: October 07, 2016, 05:24:33 PM by KenMasters »

Offline KenMasters

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Re: Which proper 4K UHD certified TV's are available in RSA?
« Reply #25 on: October 07, 2016, 05:22:53 PM »
ANY high-speed HDMI cable will work with 2.0a, you do NOT need fancy cables for it.

That's right.

Although the HDMI Consortium have been having issue with manufacturers making false claims since the High-Speed logo is so easy to duplicate. For this reason (and because it goes nicely with Ultra HD Premium certification) they've rolled out the "Premium" HDMI certification program, a special unpirateable hologramed authentication label with a unique QR code for verification to prove the cable meets High-Speed requirements.

I'm sure manufacturers will be asking a premium of their own for such labled products though. You'll be fine so long as you buy High Speed cables from a reputable source. Personally I'm a big fan of Amazon Basics - cheap and quality.

Offline El Sid

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Re: Which proper 4K UHD certified TV's are available in RSA?
« Reply #26 on: October 07, 2016, 06:32:11 PM »
ANY high-speed HDMI cable will work with 2.0a, you do NOT need fancy cables for it.
HERETIC!

That kind of talk will get you hanged...

Offline Nidri

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Re: Which proper 4K UHD certified TV's are available in RSA?
« Reply #27 on: October 07, 2016, 09:34:32 PM »
Wonder if DCI 4K (4096x2160) will ever become relevant outside the production (+projection) industries?
I'd be very peeved if DCI became a 'must-have' spec a few years down the line.
Maybe they'll call them 'direct cinema transfers' and invent a new acronym like Cine4K or True4K or 4KWide or 4KD or something.
Or am I being cynical?

Offline KenMasters

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Re: Which proper 4K UHD certified TV's are available in RSA?
« Reply #28 on: October 07, 2016, 10:26:32 PM »
Wonder if DCI 4K (4096x2160) will ever become relevant outside the production (+projection) industries?
I'd be very peeved if DCI became a 'must-have' spec a few years down the line.

It won't, that's a cinema resolution. The Ultra HD standard specifies 4K for home as 38402160 and 8k as 7680 x 4320 because those resolutions are a pixel match for HD resolutions (no interpolation of pixels when upscaling). Besides, the bump in resolution is probably the least impactful element of Ultra HD.
« Last Edit: October 07, 2016, 10:31:45 PM by KenMasters »

Offline Nidri

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Re: Which proper 4K UHD certified TV's are available in RSA?
« Reply #29 on: October 07, 2016, 10:32:21 PM »
It won't, that's a cinema resolution. The Ultra HD standard specifies 4K for home as 38402160 and 8k as 7680 x 4320 because those resolutions are a pixel match for HD resolutions (no interpolation of pixels when upscaling). Besides, the bump in resolution is probably the least impactful element of Ultra HD.

Thanks, that's good to know.