Wanted: Yamaha NS1000 tweeters & midrange drivers

[Hennie]

I was expecting much worse. Compared to Be compression drivers this thing is comparatively reasonably priced. I mean what does a Scan mid cost thesedays?

That's what I was thinking. Not a bad price at all, but if that's excessive, then your best hope is to trace a second hand box with maybe the woofers or tweeters blown. I've seen a pair in working condition advertised for about R5000.

Try AVSA ads, advertise for a damaged pair that can be raided for spare parts.

[Timber_MG]

If that is the proper sensitivity then it is certainly a very interresting driver for a wide-directivity system...though I have always had a soft spot for the ATC (which i've never had the pleasure to listen to) but never the inclination to spend quite that much.

Back then people weren't affraid to put a large diffuser over a dome mid eh? Seems like they measured with a good ole swept sine and tracking filter in a chamber and allowed engineering type measurements to slip through. How much hasn't changed since then.

I would also not know what the magnets might be like after such a long period. For a narrow baffle this thing would likely best be crossed ~400Hz to a 2x8"?

[Shonver]

...

That's what I was thinking. Not a bad price at all, but if that's excessive, then your best hope is to trace a second hand box with maybe the woofers or tweeters blown. I've seen a pair in working condition advertised for about R5000.

Try AVSA ads, advertise for a damaged pair that can be raided for spare parts.

Hmmm... R5000 is the going price I think. But I would not want to butcher a perfectly good loudspeaker. I have in fact got an ad at AVSA. I'll just have to be patient and persevere

[Hennie]

The NS1000 seems to be such a well-revered speaker that I came up against a lot of resistance on another forum where I dared to suggest that it could be improved.

The NS1000 was remarkable at the time of its introduction, but it is after all a 30 year old design. I really support your conviction that it can be improved. It was the Be drivers that made it special. The original crossover is a 12dB/Octave affair IIRC. Perhaps that was not steep enough. If you look at the individual driver response curves then you will see that the midrange breakup was not as well attenuated as one would wish. The result is some fatigue after long listening sessions. This is the main reason I sold mine - to use something less impressive in detail rendition but smoother and more satisfying in the long term. Merely updating the crossover to 4th order LR would already bring significant benefits I think. And a smaller, perhaps timbre matched woofer would be the next step I would recommend.

PS: I did play around with 24db/Oct active crossovers. I am convinced that the mid dome benefits from a steeper cutoff. It becomes noticably smoother and transients are cleaner. But if you really want to get some magic out of it, how about BruteFIR with driver correction and really steep slopes (not now, but eventually...)

[Shonver]

I, too, was considering steeper slopes, especially after learning how many people have blown their tweets & mids.

I have not played with digital correction yet but, yes, it will happen eventually...

What is your opinion of the tweeter? Right now, I can't say anything about it because I'm using fabric dome tweeters. But I was somewhat disappointed to find that the Yamaha tweeters roll off before 20kHz. I had expected the lighter diaphragm to take it to at least 30kHz. Not that I'm pretending to be able to hear that high; but it does make me wonder how good it really is. Right now, the (fast ) bass alignment and midrange purity is what does it for me. Perhaps a ribbon tweeter would add a different dimension. Your opinion on this?

[Hennie]

What is your opinion of the tweeter?............Perhaps a ribbon tweeter would add a different dimension. Your opinion on this?

I think the tweeter was exceptional at the time, and i.t.o. harmonic distortion figures probably still is. Don't know about energy storage, but I dont really expect it to be top notch. I think the double chambered Seas/Scan tweeters will beat it here. It is also not the smoothest.

In fact I was just about ready to recommend a ribbon tweeter. For the required frequency range, there are many suitable ribbons. You can even drop the mid/tweet crossover from about 6k to 4k.

Those who heard the Raal ribbons claim they are the state of the art in ribbon technology, with unmatched dynamics and class leading resolution. They are expensive, but the smaller, less expensive unit is required here:

http://www.raalribbon.com/products_flatfoil_70-10.htm

They say you save money by ordering direct from Serbia...

Raal's also have a better vetical radiation pattern compared to other ribbons, due to the foam lens fitted.

But if it is too expensive, I would consider other small units such as LCY. They also seem to have better vertical dispersion than most.

I want to do the BruteFIR thing one day, as do Martin. Maybe we could have some collaborative project one day. No hurry though.

[Timber_MG]

If you see a box with some glass above you will know....

[Hennie]

If you see a box with some glass above you will know....

BruteFIR with glass? Poor me, I have no culture. Planned for BruteFIR with sand.

[Timber_MG]

Me too, but with the sand passing a modulated sawwave through a LP filter.

[Hennie]

Then there's the glass plugin for FB2K. Dunno if it does the distortion bit.

[Shonver]

How about an NS1000 plug-in? or voicing of other popular speakers?

[Timber_MG]

The problem is that just like with devices whose purpose is to mimic tonal character of microphones (same problem turned around) you cannot really make two different devices with different power response (polar response if you wish) sound the same in a room. You can EQ out the major trends or basic characteristics, but you can only go so far.

[Shonver]

And then I suppose it will only be effective at the point of meansurement.

[Timber_MG]

Well, there are numerous approaches, but it is always best to refine a system without resorting to such means first and not try and bend problems straight with electronic means after the fact.