Author Topic: Still happy you have a Blackberry?  (Read 1251 times)

Andrew

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Still happy you have a Blackberry?
« on: October 17, 2011, 02:49:20 pm »
(CNN) -- Here's a little secret BlackBerry doesn't want you to know:

It would be technically impossible for all Android phones or iPhones to experience a global four-day outage like the one BlackBerry saw this week, according to mobile communications experts.

Why? The answer is in the technical details of how Research in Motion -- the company that makes BlackBerry smartphones, with their click-clacking keyboards and tie-wearing owners -- handles e-mails and text messages.

Here's the gist: RIM acts as a middleman for all e-mail and BlackBerry text messages. It picks up messages from the wireless carrier and passes them on to the recipient.
BlackBerry says outage restored

Androids and iPhones don't have a middleman for texts and e-mail.

It's this BlackBerry baton-passing system that went down Monday, killing or slowing e-mail and texting services for millions of people in Europe, North America, South America, Asia, the Middle East and Africa. The ordeal lasted four days.

"It's because of the way RIM has set up the (network) architecture that is the downfall when it comes to these types of outages," said Sean Armstrong, who manages wireless communications at a large tech company. "When it's working fine, it's a great system. When it's not working fine, it's a failure."

This week, it's fair to say the system was a big ol' failure. On social media sites, some BlackBerry users said they were so upset about the outage -- the largest in the company's history -- that they were switching to Apple iOS and Google Android devices. And customer satisfaction with BlackBerry already was low.

"Add up every other thing we've ever written about why BlackBerry is dying," wrote the tech blog Gizmodo. "This is worse."

This is not to say that Androids and iPhones never experience network outages.

But they wouldn't be global. And they would be the responsibility of a particular wireless carrier -- AT&T, Sprint, Verizon and T-Mobile -- or a particular messaging system, like Gmail, Hotmail or iMessage, Apple's new in-house messaging service. Not the maker of the phone.

That makes their problems inherently more localized.

"All the stuff goes through them for some form or fashion," Nan Palmero, a writer for the site BlackBerryCool.com, said of the way BlackBerry handles messages and e-mail. That makes it possible, he said, for the global BlackBerry network to crash, which wouldn't be the case for iPhones or Androids.

RIM, however, takes issue with this analysis.

"I would not characterize that as fair," RIM's co-CEO Mike Lazaridis said at a Thursday news conference. "We run a global, secure-push environment that provides the kind of instant messaging that's made BlackBerry so compelling and so valuable."

RIM filters e-mails and BlackBerry messages through its own server farms -- giant warehouses full of computers -- for security reasons, said Armstrong. The company scrambles messages, making them more difficult to intercept.

That's won BlackBerry big fans in the business world.

The system also uses less battery power because RIM handles much of the computation work, Armstrong said.

"The process for checking your e-mail with a BlackBerry is done by the RIM servers," he said. "So RIM is going to handle all the heavy lifting of going to your inbox and looking for new e-mail, and if it finds new e-mail, it's going to push it back your devices."

It also creates the risk of a global crash.

But maybe that's not a completely bad thing.

"For two years, we haven't had a huge issue like this," Armstrong said. "It's just been little bumps along the way. So I don't really see (the middle-man system) as a weakness. I see it as expected, because no system can be faultless."

Rich Miller, who runs the industry blog Data Center Knowledge, said it's clear BlackBerry was unprepared for a failure like the one that began on Monday.

"From what we can see from this outage, it appears RIM doesn't have the infrastructure or the process in place to handle a failure properly when it happens and then to recover from it once it's got a backlog of e-mail in its pipes," he said.

RIM has said this week's outage was caused by a failure at one of its messaging servers in Europe, along with the subsequent failure of its backup system.

Mike Gikas, a senior editor for technology at Consumer Reports, said problems like the one BlackBerry had this week could actually become more common because people are storing more of their data -- from photos to music and documents -- in the cloud, meaning on remote computer servers rather than at home.

"If these services ever get disrupted, that could just mean a lot of unhappy customers," he said. "More and more of our stuff is stored on remote servers, and there's increasing burden on the networks to have them available 24/7."

As the BlackBerry outage shows, he said, not all of them are ready.

http://edition.cnn.com/2011/10/13/tech/mobile/blackberry-servers-android-iphone/index.html
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BigWoodenSpoon

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Re: Still happy you have a Blackberry?
« Reply #1 on: October 17, 2011, 03:23:53 pm »
Yes I do !

iPhone and Android'ers will be quick to point out that they can never have an outage like BB did. And they're right, because they don't have a secure service like RIM does so its like saying: my Merc will never break-down because I don't have a Merc

 ;)
         

frikkie

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Re: Still happy you have a Blackberry?
« Reply #2 on: October 17, 2011, 03:50:39 pm »
Old news.

What I will say though - how the **** did they have a single point of failure in such a massive network? A core switch failed, bringing the entire network down. Excuse me? Where are the failovers, the redundant equipment with automatica failover, not to mention the failover's backup?

Surely, SURELY, they can't keep a global network running without redundancy?

Seems they can indeed. RIM deserves to sink after this fiasco.
You read it here first - RIM is going to be bought outright by another player in the industry. Soon. RIM is dead. As much as I like the Blackberry platform, the company is in trouble...
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Andrew

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Re: Still happy you have a Blackberry?
« Reply #3 on: October 17, 2011, 03:58:25 pm »
Old news.

What I will say though - how the **** did they have a single point of failure in such a massive network? A core switch failed, bringing the entire network down. Excuse me? Where are the failovers, the redundant equipment with automatica failover, not to mention the failover's backup?

Surely, SURELY, they can't keep a global network running without redundancy?

Seems they can indeed. RIM deserves to sink after this fiasco.
You read it here first - RIM is going to be bought outright by another player in the industry. Soon. RIM is dead. As much as I like the Blackberry platform, the company is in trouble...

I was reading earlier, and the report I saw said that a backlog of emails caused the problems, but don't know if it was one or the early 'guess the cause' news items. Will see if I can find it.

Edit: As you said, core switch...which then caused the huge backlog I read about, making the problem worse.
« Last Edit: October 17, 2011, 04:08:10 pm by AVSA Andrew »
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Atjan

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Re: Still happy you have a Blackberry?
« Reply #4 on: October 17, 2011, 05:18:30 pm »
Old news.

What I will say though - how the **** did they have a single point of failure in such a massive network? A core switch failed, bringing the entire network down. Excuse me? Where are the failovers, the redundant equipment with automatica failover, not to mention the failover's backup?

Surely, SURELY, they can't keep a global network running without redundancy?

Seems they can indeed. RIM deserves to sink after this fiasco.
You read it here first - RIM is going to be bought outright by another player in the industry. Soon. RIM is dead. As much as I like the Blackberry platform, the company is in trouble...
The security aspect is great if you are a spy, terrorist, head of r&d at a multi trillion dollar hi tech company or a general  international man of mystry (spelling?). For me....meh. If the government wants to check private messages to my wife....they are more bored than I thought. ;)
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Andrew

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Re: Still happy you have a Blackberry?
« Reply #5 on: October 17, 2011, 06:50:53 pm »
Methinks I'll go Android come renewal time. iPhone nice, but yoh...just a tad expensive. Not intending to slight any BB user, but my experience has been that the BB is regarded as a non-negotiable part of teenager Life Equipment? Heck, not even teenagers. Was at the new yard in the South, taking my (teenager) rider though to exercise the horse, and within moments of the youngsters there...around 12, 13, I'd guess?... they were already swapping BBM numbers. Android and iPhone don't seem to have the same presence, in numbers, with the youngsters? Or is that an incorrect perception?
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Atjan

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Re: Still happy you have a Blackberry?
« Reply #6 on: October 17, 2011, 07:08:49 pm »
Methinks I'll go Android come renewal time. iPhone nice, but yoh...just a tad expensive. Not intending to slight any BB user, but my experience has been that the BB is regarded as a non-negotiable part of teenager Life Equipment? Heck, not even teenagers. Was at the new yard in the South, taking my (teenager) rider though to exercise the horse, and within moments of the youngsters there...around 12, 13, I'd guess?... they were already swapping BBM numbers. Android and iPhone don't seem to have the same presence, in numbers, with the youngsters? Or is that an incorrect perception?
Females and teenagers....
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Steerpike

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Re: Still happy you have a Blackberry?
« Reply #7 on: October 17, 2011, 07:42:22 pm »
And they're right, because they don't have a secure service like RIM does

I have none of these pocket toys, so I can't talk specifics. But where is the flaw in my understanding that any message I want to send really privately to you, I should be encoding at my end, and you decoding at your end - not relying on or trusting the network provider. Any device that runs user installable software can work like that.

ghostinthemachine

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Re: Still happy you have a Blackberry?
« Reply #8 on: October 17, 2011, 08:45:04 pm »
And here I got a BB in the middle of all this sh!t... lol...
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Mervin

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Re: Still happy you have a Blackberry?
« Reply #9 on: October 18, 2011, 07:44:42 am »
Blackberry
- sat on its laurels
- Very difficult Operating System (OS) to develop for however they bought QNX which should help
iPhone
- Locked and limited in countries where 'iStores' are not allowed (SA one of them)
Android based
- depending on vendor, really leading edge and outselling iPhone (including touch as well) by the numbers.
- Cost of OS is much lower allowing for much better bang for buck.  Amazon Fire $199

I have taken up a Samsung S (Rodney_Gold the SII) and will not look back.  My wife and son having BB's said if they had a choice again it would not be BB but an Andriod phone.

Ian

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Re: Still happy you have a Blackberry?
« Reply #10 on: October 18, 2011, 07:50:04 am »
A Blackberry is a lovely little toy but its real value IMHO, is in it's BBM
If you're family and friends also own Blackberry's it becomes an essential, and free, once you've bought your BIS, way of comunicating, sending pics etc etc.
Much as the downtime was annoying it would never make me give up my Blackberry, but as i say above it really is dependant on how many other people you know with Blackberry's
Just out of interest, and I dont know why, but my e-mail and internet access, FB, Twitter,  etc. never failed, it was only the BBM I lost.

frikkie

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Re: Still happy you have a Blackberry?
« Reply #11 on: October 18, 2011, 07:54:09 am »
A Blackberry is a lovely little toy but its real value IMHO, is in it's BBM
If you're family and friends also own Blackberry's it becomes an essential, and free, once you've bought your BIS, way of comunicating, sending pics etc etc.
Much as the downtime was annoying it would never make me give up my Blackberry, but as i say above it really is dependant on how many other people you know with Blackberry's
Just out of interest, and I dont know why, but my e-mail and internet access, FB, Twitter,  etc. never failed, it was only the BBM I lost.

I have a BB, and very seldom use BBM. Reason being I have very few friends with BBs.

Whatsapp etc do the same, if not better, for negligible data cost. My GF, for instance, has a 10MB data bundle on her contract - specifically for IM etc - at a cost of R7. It lasts more than a month, with us on Whatsapp virtually all day, every day.
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Willi

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Re: Still happy you have a Blackberry?
« Reply #12 on: October 18, 2011, 07:55:29 am »
I'm on my fourth Blackberry now, and still love it. The BB downtime didn't really affect me at all - I just sent regular SMS' and used the iPad for mail during this time.

That said, I've placed my order for the new iPhone :D



Atjan

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Re: Still happy you have a Blackberry?
« Reply #13 on: October 18, 2011, 07:56:10 am »
A Blackberry is a lovely little toy but its real value IMHO, is in it's BBM
If you're family and friends also own Blackberry's it becomes an essential, and free, once you've bought your BIS, way of comunicating, sending pics etc etc.
Much as the downtime was annoying it would never make me give up my Blackberry, but as i say above it really is dependant on how many other people you know with Blackberry's
Just out of interest, and I dont know why, but my e-mail and internet access, FB, Twitter,  etc. never failed, it was only the BBM I lost.

www.whatsapp.com

There's life after BBM.  ;)

EDIT: Oh, thanks Frikkie.  ;D
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Prince

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Re: Still happy you have a Blackberry?
« Reply #14 on: October 18, 2011, 08:15:29 am »
-When I renewed my contract this year I had a choice of all smartphones, but in the end I chose Blackberry. Why?

My dilemma was to have integrated internet access with the cellphone package at a reasonable price and non of the Android or iPhone packages gave me this. Whichever way I looked at it, it worked out more expensive. Yes, my heart was set on an Android handset, but I was not prepared to pay exhorbitant data bundle packages for internet access.

So for a monthly fee of R59 for internet access - bargain!!
My cellphone bill actually came down in cost and I got alot more value and let me tell you, both my kids already looking at acquiring BB's next year!
-Yes systems fail and we all can say sitting on the other end, that this and that could have been done better. I'm in no way covering up RIM's mess, they deserve the backlash for creating a core business service and not making it more robust!!

And while that "cheap" BIS service is around, I will always consider a BB above an Android phone, cause in SA we are getting ripped solid for internet access!!
-Flaming not allowed!!  ;D ;D

 ;D

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